Offense struggling

[atemp]

...I just don't get it, a change should've happened a long time ago, and yet the theme is still the same. The O-Line is experienced, WR quite a few started, RB...according to Ferentz is a spot where someone can play right away, experience at QB...and it's still the same. Maybe it's coaching? If players aren't improving and developing I think that's an issue....

http://www.gazetteonline.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080816/SPORTS/681401387/1056

[Soda Popinski]

Cubs are still scoring lots of runs.

[Rufus]

The offense always struggles in scrimmages and pre-season practice. KF is just playing his standard low-expectations game.

[Debit One]

The offense always struggles in scrimmages and pre-season practice. KF is just playing his standard low-expectations game.

Uh, yeah, that's it.

:roll:

[maintain242001]

I cant believe people think this team will win more than 7 games....and that's due to our defense being pretty decent but they'll break when they are on the field 2/3's of the game

[Gushawk]

Decent open practice blog:

http://football.hawkmania.com/2008/08/17/report-card-open-practice/

[Mo T]

The offense will be awful this year. The defense will have to be outstanding for this team to win 7-8 games.

[Verbal]

The offense has 4 weeks yet until it needs to be any good. Plenty of time. If the offense had lit up the first team defense, you'd all be equally, if not more, worried.

[MikeyJoe]

The offense always struggles in scrimmages and pre-season practice and during the season.
Fixed.

[R.M. Renfield]

The offense always struggles in scrimmages and pre-season practice and during the season.
Fixed.

Iowa has put up the top-scoring offense in the conference 2 or 3 times since 2001, I believe.

[Glen]

The offense always struggles in scrimmages and pre-season practice and during the season.
Fixed.

Iowa has put up the top-scoring offense in the conference 2 or 3 times since 2001, I believe.

Different times, rm. Our offensive line guru of a hc is fielding a unit that gave up 14 sacks in a scrimmage. Couple that with an inconsistent qb and lack of depth at key skill postions, and no one will confuse these guys with Brad Banks and Co.

I see 4-5 wins and season long drinking binge.

What's frustrating is to hear KF complain that few of the players are competing with a fire. His concern is telling.

[nolookpass]

Fixed.

Iowa has put up the top-scoring offense in the conference 2 or 3 times since 2001, I believe.

Different times, rm. Our offensive line guru of a hc is fielding a unit that gave up 14 sacks in a scrimmage. Couple that with an inconsistent qb and lack of depth at key skill postions, and no one will confuse these guys with Brad Banks and Co.

I see 4-5 wins and season long drinking binge.

What's frustrating is to hear KF complain that few of the players are competing with a fire. His concern is telling.

the players just reflect a large part of the staff.

[atemp]

Iowa has put up the top-scoring offense in the conference 2 or 3 times since 2001, I believe.

Different times, rm. Our offensive line guru of a hc is fielding a unit that gave up 14 sacks in a scrimmage. Couple that with an inconsistent qb and lack of depth at key skill postions, and no one will confuse these guys with Brad Banks and Co.

I see 4-5 wins and season long drinking binge.

What's frustrating is to hear KF complain that few of the players are competing with a fire. His concern is telling.

the players just reflect a large part of the staff.

...I agree with this statement 100%. I like that Rick K. defensive line coach..and the WR Coach from Michigan has a good track record (not sure how much of that is his coaching or Michigan just bringing in players), but other than that think the staff has some major concerns. I can understand Norm not wanting to leave, but other than Ron Aiken and Philbin...I don't know that any of these guys are in high demand. Coaches were being picked off of Hayden's staff quite a bit more frequently.

Those blurbs about "Best Coaching Staff in America" sound pretty humorous about now.

[Glen]

Iowa has put up the top-scoring offense in the conference 2 or 3 times since 2001, I believe.

Different times, rm. Our offensive line guru of a hc is fielding a unit that gave up 14 sacks in a scrimmage. Couple that with an inconsistent qb and lack of depth at key skill postions, and no one will confuse these guys with Brad Banks and Co.

I see 4-5 wins and season long drinking binge.

What's frustrating is to hear KF complain that few of the players are competing with a fire. His concern is telling.

the players just reflect a large part of the staff.

Maybe. But I've had shitty coaches before, and to lay all the blame on them is too much. The players have to execute consistently and take some owenership.

[Rufus]

Our offensive line guru of a hc is fielding a unit that gave up 14 sacks in a scrimmage.Again, that always happens in scrimmages and pre-season practice.

[Glen]

Our offensive line guru of a hc is fielding a unit that gave up 14 sacks in a scrimmage.Again, that always happens in scrimmages and pre-season practice.

Given how much rides on the performance of the offensive line (and the underperformance of this unit the last couple of years) your response does little to assuage my fears. The hawkmania blog Gus linked gave the OL an F. If giving up sacks is to be expected, why the failing grade?

If this team cannot run and cannot pass block, we are in for another long season.

[Rufus]

The hawkmania blog Gus linked gave the OL an F. And several sources said our 2002 O-line was a weak spot prior to that season.

[Glen]

The hawkmania blog Gus linked gave the OL an F. And several sources said our 2002 O-line was a weak spot prior to that season.


I hope you're right. The last thing in the world I want to do is malroot the Hawks.

[Verbal]

If this team cannot run and cannot pass block, we are in for another long season.

Again, you'd be saying the exact same thing if the defense couldn't stop the run or develop a pass rush. That the defense outplayed the offense for an hour on Saturday, August 16th is hardly demonstrative of anything.

[Rufus]

The hawkmania blog Gus linked gave the OL an F. And several sources said our 2002 O-line was a weak spot prior to that season.
I hope you're right. The last thing in the world I want to do is malroot the Hawks.
I'm not saying that the O-line will be great. What I am saying is that relying on a reporter to give you an accurate analysis or prediction in football is silly. Anytime you think otherwise, think of all of the media publications who thought that Iowa's 2002 o-line (dubbed later by some as potentially one of the best in college football history) as a unit that was expected to struggle.

[Verbal]

Our offensive line guru of a hc is fielding a unit that gave up 14 sacks in a scrimmage.Again, that always happens in scrimmages and pre-season practice.

Yep. Consider the following:

Offense = a series of scripted movements
Defense = reactions to those movements

When the offense has a finite number of possible movements, the reactions by the defense to those movements become quicker and more effective after a certain number of repetitions thereof. Stated another way, Saturday's performance should not surprise anyone, but neither should it be a basis for any type of serious analysis of the offense's ability to perform. Let me see the offense against a defense that has never reacted to its movements before, then we can begin to form our judgments. I think what we'll find is that the offense is better than what was shown on Saturday. Not top-of-the league good, but good enough to win some games.

[Glen]

And several sources said our 2002 O-line was a weak spot prior to that season.
I hope you're right. The last thing in the world I want to do is malroot the Hawks.
I'm not saying that the O-line will be great. What I am saying is that relying on a reporter to give you an accurate analysis or prediction in football is silly. Anytime you think otherwise, think of all of the media publications who thought that Iowa's 2002 o-line (dubbed later by some as potentially one of the best in college football history) as a unit that was expected to struggle.

And if my only source to my worry was this reporter, you'd be right. I've got the last two years performance, as well as the head coach expressing his concerns.

I'd prefer to prepare for the worst and hope for the best.

[Glen]

Our offensive line guru of a hc is fielding a unit that gave up 14 sacks in a scrimmage.Again, that always happens in scrimmages and pre-season practice.

Yep. Consider the following:

Offense = a series of scripted movements
Defense = reactions to those movements

When the offense has a finite number of possible movements, the reactions by the defense to those movements become quicker and more effective after a certain number of repetitions thereof. Stated another way, Saturday's performance should not surprise anyone, but neither should it be a basis for any type of serious analysis of the offense's ability to perform. Let me see the offense against a defense that has never reacted to its movements before, then we can begin to form our judgments. I think what we'll find is that the offense is better than what was shown on Saturday. Not top-of-the league good, but good enough to win some games.

Think about our offense, though. Everyone in the world knows what they're trying to do. As Rufus said, in 2002 it didn't matter, because the group was able to execute and we had skill position players in place to make plays.

Fast forward to this year, and the line hasn't executed and we lack skill position players. I'm not trying to be chicken little here, but OL is a major concern, given it's importance.

[MikeyJoe]

The problem, IMO, isn't just that the offense struggled. That's to be expected, for a variety or reasons listed above. What I'm most worried about is the reported ease with which the DL blew past the OL. Familiarity with the plays isn't going to cause that.

[Rufus]

What I'm most worried about is the reported ease with which the DL blew past the OL. Familiarity with the plays isn't going to cause that.Actually, that's exactly what causes it (in addition to the nature of scrimmages/defensive play in general).

Also, realize that this defensive front 4 is one of the best that Iowa's O-line will face all year.

[scottsdalehawk]

The problem, IMO, isn't just that the offense struggled. That's to be expected, for a variety or reasons listed above. What I'm most worried about is the reported ease with which the DL blew past the OL. Familiarity with the plays isn't going to cause that.

Let's hope the Hawks have the best d-line in college football history.

I won't be concerned until the Iowa St game. There is still about a month until they'll face a real test. Hopefully that month will be full of improvement.

[Verbal]

Evidence that this isn't unique to Iowa: it was reported on the other board that the Mizzou defense dominated the offense and Chase Daniel looked like a lost puppy during their intra-squad scrimmage over the weekend. Daniel is among the top 3-4 likely Heisman Trophy candidates. On the flip side, CJ Bacher and the Northwestern offense cruised in their scrimmage. Anyone want to make a bet that the Northwestern defense will suck this year?

[Debit One]

I'm not buying the whole "the D-line knew what was coming" excuse for what clearly was poor OL play.

Out of 80 pass plays, there were 63 thrown balls and 17 sacks. That's over 20% of passing plays resulting in a sack. There's no way to explain that one away.

The #1 RB, Shonn Greene, who presumably was running behind the #1 line, had 10 attempts for 19 yards. I also presume that not all of those attempts were against the #1 defense.

While I accept that there is some truth in the familiarity theory, and also accept the statement that if the offense had looked too good we would be worrying about the defense, what everyone wanted to see as an area of improvement is still a worry. The fact is that this OL, which along with QB play were the two big sore spots last season, is still struggling. The fans see it, the coaches see it, and the players themselves see it if you look at the quotes from after the scrimmage.

[Glen]

The #1 RB, Shonn Greene, who presumably was running behind the #1 line, had 10 attempts for 19 yards. I also presume that not all of those attempts were against the #1 defense.

That's a good point. Didn't I read the #1 Offense started against the #2 Defense?

[Rufus]

I'm not buying the whole "the D-line knew what was coming" excuse for what clearly was poor OL play.

Out of 80 pass plays, there were 63 thrown balls and 17 sacks. That's over 20% of passing plays resulting in a sack. There's no way to explain that one away.
Yes there is. In scrimmages, "sacks" aren't really sacks. Anytime the QB is even about to be grazed, the whistle sounds as a sack. That's just not a game time reality. Secondly, if you'll notice, for about the first 10 "sacks", the offense was playing pass only, which means that without the threat of a run, those "sacks" came extraordinarily easy.

[HawkLax6]

Sounds like Doering has a broken wrist, will be out multiple weeks.

Blah.

[Debit One]

I'm not buying the whole "the D-line knew what was coming" excuse for what clearly was poor OL play.

Out of 80 pass plays, there were 63 thrown balls and 17 sacks. That's over 20% of passing plays resulting in a sack. There's no way to explain that one away.
Yes there is. In scrimmages, "sacks" aren't really sacks. Anytime the QB is even about to be grazed, the whistle sounds as a sack. That's just not a game time reality. Secondly, if you'll notice, for about the first 10 "sacks", the offense was playing pass only, which means that without the threat of a run, those "sacks" came extraordinarily easy.

Rufus, I'm going to just agree to disagree with you. You seem to think that the offense isn't a problem, and I think that it is a HUGE problem. What you see as valid reasons for the offense not looking sharp I see as excuses.

We'll see in a few weeks. The ISU game will probably be the first real indication that we have about where this team is at.

[Gushawk]

The broken record that concerns me is that, yet again for whatever reason, no one seems to be stepping up to seize opportunities on the OL and, as a result, it is a unit in flux and disarray heading into the season. Say what you want about press regarding the 2002 line, but we certainly didn't have a similar situation heading into that season. By and large we knew who was going to be playing where, barring injuries. For the past several seasons, clear roles on the OL haven't been established in camp...or in some cases even well into the season. Not surprisingly, the result has been a line that underperformed, and oftentimes looked like it didn't know what it was doing.

[scottsdalehawk]

Sounds like Doering has a broken wrist, will be out multiple weeks.

Blah.

Was he starting?

[HawkLax6]

Sounds like Doering has a broken wrist, will be out multiple weeks.

Blah.

Was he starting?

I really don't think there are any starters set in stone at this point (aside from Olsen and probably Bulaga). Sounds like he was competing for a guard spot.

[atemp]

The broken record that concerns me is that, yet again for whatever reason, no one seems to be stepping up to seize opportunities on the OL and, as a result, it is a unit in flux and disarray heading into the season. Say what you want about press regarding the 2002 line, but we certainly didn't have a similar situation heading into that season. By and large we knew who was going to be playing where, barring injuries. For the past several seasons, clear roles on the OL haven't been established in camp...or in some cases even well into the season. Not surprisingly, the result has been a line that underperformed, and oftentimes looked like it didn't know what it was doing.

The O-Line has regressed since Reese Morgan has taken over. Ferentz has backed him over and over saying how great of a coach he is....but the results say otherwise. The O-Line has pretty much been a bunch of Sallies since Gallery left (sans Yanda....but he was a JUCO, so if he would've been at Iowa a little longer he probably would've regressed as well). This is just another example of institutionalized thinking within Iowa Football. Ferentz just refuses to take a contrarian (think critically) viewpoint when it comes to evaluating his staff.

[jeffcudd]

The broken record that concerns me is that, yet again for whatever reason, no one seems to be stepping up to seize opportunities on the OL and, as a result, it is a unit in flux and disarray heading into the season. Say what you want about press regarding the 2002 line, but we certainly didn't have a similar situation heading into that season. By and large we knew who was going to be playing where, barring injuries. For the past several seasons, clear roles on the OL haven't been established in camp...or in some cases even well into the season. Not surprisingly, the result has been a line that underperformed, and oftentimes looked like it didn't know what it was doing.

The O-Line has regressed since Reese Morgan has taken over. Ferentz has backed him over and over saying how great of a coach he is....but the results say otherwise. The O-Line has pretty much been a bunch of Sallies since Gallery left (sans Yanda....but he was a JUCO, so if he would've been at Iowa a little longer he probably would've regressed as well). This is just another example of institutionalized thinking within Iowa Football. Ferentz just refuses to take a contrarian (think critically) viewpoint when it comes to evaluating his staff.

Could not agree more. All indications point to Morgan being extremely below average. This is the most experienced O-line group in the conference. This unit should be the strength of this team. As it stands, it's the most concerning. It's not a matter of talent, it's a matter of execution, which is a direct reflection on coaching. How Ferentz can let it get this bad is beyond me.

[Gushawk]

I'm not sure it's execution or technique. I think it's lack of fire, pride and hard work.