**Official Midwest Region First Round Game Thread (12) Richmond vs (5) Iowa 2:10PM tru-TV

[Thanksgiving Dinner]

Look at what you've done. L Wade is the voice of reason.

fucked up to think about

 

[Hawkstrat]

I don't think expectations prior to the season should matter that much.

Prior to the season I thought Keegan would be good, I did not think he would be one of the very best players in the nation. I feel like that's more relevant than what I thought before the season started.

 

[Harlan]

@Kamala is moving into @JR Hawks territory with stupid takes

He also thought the Iowa Athletic department and Kirk Ferentz wanted to purposely lose football games, so…

 

[Kamala]

He also thought the Iowa Athletic department and Kirk Ferentz wanted to purposely lose football games, so…

I did?

 

[Harlan]

I did?

Yes you did.

 

[Fletch]

So you contend, on the morning of round 2 in 2016, MSU fans wouldnt have changed places with us if they could? Because I think most would.

No, sorry, you don’t get to move goalposts. That’s not at all what your stated position has been.

 

[Kamala]

Yes you did.

Link please

 

[Kamala]

No, sorry, you don’t get to move goalposts. That’s not at all what your stated position has been.

How so? My contention is that the better year is the year with the most postseason success. They would have rather been in our position because our position was better.

 

[Shpadoinkle]

Maybe I’m crazy, but it’s entirely possible to be pissed off your favorite team didn’t make (or hasn’t made) a good run in the tournament without feeling like it’s an indictment on the coach or program.

Its fun as hell when the hawks have made a run. Last weekend was also fun as hell. AND, they got to take home some actual hardware.

This season was supposed to be a throw away year and most of us would’ve been thrilled just to make the tourney. That was fucking impossible on February 1st.

I’d say Fran still has Iowa on an upward trajectory. How long had it been since an Iowa player was drafted until last year? They’ve gone from no all big ten players to honorable mentions to first teamers to POYs and POY candidates. Top half finishes are now the expectation as is making the tourney. The run will come and it will be glorious.

 

[MikeyJoe]

It seems really, really, really stupid to bank all of your enjoyment on an entire year of fandom on the results of 1-2 single elimination games.

I'm really disappointed by Thursday. I still really enjoyed this year.

 

[Billy Butters]

I don't think expectations prior to the season should matter that much.

Prior to the season I thought Keegan would be good, I did not think he would be one of the very best players in the nation. I feel like that's more relevant than what I thought before the season started.

How about a month and a half ago when you still didn't think Iowa would make the tourney? Do those expectations matter? This team overachieved.

 

[MikeyJoe]

Also, there is no objective "Sweet 16" level of measurement for fandom. You only think so because of Iowa regularly not attaining it.

I promise you, if you were a fan of a team that regularly got 1-2 seeds but then always fell out before the Elite 8, you'd be here bitching about that. If you were a fan of a mid-major that made the tournament every few years, you'd be ecstatic with making it to the round of 32.

 

[snips]

so you win the big 10 tournament... and have a first team all american... and are playing the # 6 team in the A10.... shouldn't you win that shit? maybe?

 

[Kamala]

It seems really, really, really stupid to bank all of your enjoyment on an entire year of fandom on the results of 1-2 single elimination games.

I'm really disappointed by Thursday. I still really enjoyed this year.

So did I.

edit: From February through Thursday morning

 

[HzzzHawk]

You made my point in your last sentence. This was the year to finally return to the Sweet 16. The team had finally started to gel. There is no way to characterize this loss as anything but heartbreaking. We'll just have to disagree.

yah but it took me about 2 seconds to get over this loss. It was just like lol that’s one of the biggest piece of turd games that there could be. Then i went on with my life.

I was a FR in college for the unlv loss in 87. We all watched in the dorm and everyone was going nuts until the tide turned. So depressing. That was really hard for me to get over. Worst experience I’ve ever had as a fan of any sports team and that includes hearing that Chris Street had died.

of course I will admit that Iowa basketball was way more important to me in the 80s and 90s than it is now. Maybe Lick and Alford killed the fun and it never came back. Or maybe I just got interested in more other things. But back in the 80s for me and my kith and kin every Iowa game was a major event and that UNLV loss was a big kick in the nuts

 

[Hawk&Balls]

so you win the big 10 tournament... and have a first team all american... and are playing the # 6 team in the A10.... shouldn't you win that shit? maybe?

Iowa fan thinks March madness is so popular because the team that is supposed to win always wins

 

[MikeyJoe]

so you win the big 10 tournament... and have a first team all american... and are playing the # 6 team in the A10.... shouldn't you win that shit? maybe?

Who said otherwise? Why do you think everyone is so disappointed?

 

[HiawathaHawk]

so you win the big 10 tournament... and have a first team all american... and are playing the # 6 team in the A10.... shouldn't you win that shit? maybe?

You should. When you’re the #6 team in the country with the national POY plus multiple other 1st rounders, you should beat the 2nd best team from the #19 league. It’s kind of the reason the whole country gets into this thing every year. It’s awesome when it happens to someone else and shitty when it happens to your team.

 

[MikeyJoe]

I don't want to be "Above it all fan" because that guy is fucking annoying, but also some people appear to be adopting a weird position something like "If you don't completely lose your shit like me then you must be okay with mediocrity."

 

[bigazzturkeylegs]

Do you think Oregon State’s program is anywhere in the realm of ours?

They've had more tournament success this century, which is ultimately the only thing that matters in this sport.

 

[L. Wade Childress]

They've had more tournament success this century, which is ultimately the only thing that matters in this sport.

lol, no

 

[L. Wade Childress]

I don't want to be "Above it all fan" because that guy is fucking annoying, but also some people appear to be adopting a weird position something like "If you don't completely lose your shit like me then you must be okay with mediocrity."

people who think this way are typically complete losers who DEMAND EXCELLENCE from college players to feel better about themselves.

 

[Harlan]

Link please

DYOFR

 

[Kamala]

DYOFR

Well since I don’t remember saying it, or ever even thinking it, I’m not going to research that and will assume you are a liar and a scumbag until proven differently.

 

[pjhawk]

yah but it took me about 2 seconds to get over this loss. It was just like lol that’s one of the biggest piece of turd games that there could be. Then i went on with my life.

I was a FR in college for the unlv loss in 87. We all watched in the dorm and everyone was going nuts until the tide turned. So depressing. That was really hard for me to get over. Worst experience I’ve ever had as a fan of any sports team and that includes hearing that Chris Street had died.

of course I will admit that Iowa basketball was way more important to me in the 80s and 90s than it is now. Maybe Lick and Alford killed the fun and it never came back. Or maybe I just got interested in more other things. But back in the 80s for me and my kith and kin every Iowa game was a major event and that UNLV loss was a big kick in the nuts

You were still in the dorm on the Sunday night of spring break? I was at home, that game was by a long distance the most heartbreaking, frustrating loss for an Iowa fan in pretty much any sport. Get ahead 55-36 with a minute or two left in the half, then UNLV goes on a 44-17 run and you think the game's over then Iowa comes back from an 8 pt deficit and has the ball with a chance to win in the last few seconds. I still don't get why they tried to go with the alley--oop to Lohaus, but whatever.

It's good that Fran has won something now, but this season will always be tainted by that first round loss. What is the 06 team remembered for? The BiG tourney championship or the meltdown in the first round of the tourney? This is different because this team over-performed expectations by winning the BiG tourney, but it still sucks.

 

[douglasbader]

The last 2 pages of this thread (along with the possibility that Kris might be gone as well) is why I might even encourage Fran to look into taking another job and getting the fuck out of Iowa City and away from our piece of shit fans. IowaFan is just the fucking worst and we don't deserve him at this point.

It's always funny watching the random people (and not so random) come out of the woodwork the second Iowa loses a big game. They don't post shit most of if not the entire year, but the second something bad happens it is like flies on shit.

Thursday sucked. It sucked fucking hard, but it is the only time that Fran has truly shit the bed in the NCAA tournament at Iowa. He's been close to getting to the Sweet 16 and unfortunately the ball bounced the wrong way for him in 2019 when they were so damn close to doing it.

Anyways, the same fucksticks that were sucking his and the entire teams balls on right up until 2pm on Thursday now want him declared a complete failure and possibly gone.

Not really Fran's fault that his star player decided to not play defense and act like a complete weirdo for most of the game.

 

[AZmessDAWG]

I predict Kris and Keegan come back next year.

No it’s not “what I’ve been hearing” and no it’s not going on my podcast.

 

[Fletch]

No offense to Keegan, but if he’s back next year, he’s an idiot.

 

[Hawkstrat]

I predict Kris and Keegan come back next year.

No it’s not “what I’ve been hearing” and no it’s not going on my podcast.

Any particular reason you think Keegan returns?

Kenyon started the thread "A Boy and his Dream."

 

[AZmessDAWG]

Nope just gut feeling.

 

[B19Rob]

The last 2 pages of this thread (along with the possibility that Kris might be gone as well) is why I might even encourage Fran to look into taking another job and getting the fuck out of Iowa City and away from our piece of shit fans. IowaFan is just the fucking worst and we don't deserve him at this point.

It's always funny watching the random people (and not so random) come out of the woodwork the second Iowa loses a big game. They don't post shit most of if not the entire year, but the second something bad happens it is like flies on shit.

Thursday sucked. It sucked fucking hard, but it is the only time that Fran has truly shit the bed in the NCAA tournament at Iowa. He's been close to getting to the Sweet 16 and unfortunately the ball bounced the wrong way for him in 2019 when they were so damn close to doing it.

Anyways, the same fucksticks that were sucking his and the entire teams balls on right up until 2pm on Thursday now want him declared a complete failure and possibly gone.

Not really Fran's fault that his star player decided to not play defense and act like a complete weirdo for most of the game.

I agree with you that fans are overreacting to one bad loss, but where is this fairy tale school of exclusively rational and respectful fans? Any fan base that actually cares is going to be angry when they get upset in the tournament. Do you think Kentucky fans are giving coach Cal a pass on their loss? He's arguably the most successful coach of the last 15 years and some Kentucky fans want him gone. Every fan base is fucking stupid and Fran knows this better than any of us.

 

[The Dad]

The average fan is a faggot. The fan who bitches about the average fan is 1000 times worse.

 

[Talkin' Goat]

What about the fan who bitches about the average fan who bitches about the average fan?

 

[Hawkstrat]

Fran's seat shouldn't be hot (which it isn't), and he's not some pitiable victim of an unreasonable fanbase.

 

[TurdBurgler]

Always loved the treatment Alford got at ucla. Fans suck everywhere especially when you lose. Has to be hard raising kids in that environment but clearly they both made that choice.

 

[L. Wade Childress]

I agree with you that fans are overreacting to one bad loss, but where is this fairy tale school of exclusively rational and respectful fans? Any fan base that actually cares is going to be angry when they get upset in the tournament. Do you think Kentucky fans are giving coach Cal a pass on their loss? He's arguably the most successful coach of the last 15 years and some Kentucky fans want him gone. Every fan base is fucking stupid and Fran knows this better than any of us.

fran is a thoughtful and pragmatic individual. I am guessing he does an honest assessment of his personal goals and whether or not he can accomplish them here. His priority seems to be his family and players so I don’t think he’s going anywhere.

there were a number of programs that looked at Fran at least in passing that would be much better off right now with him in their program. The question is whether rebuilding a program motivates Fran or getting to a final four, and what place gives him the best support to do so.

 

[Rolo Tomassi]

yah but it took me about 2 seconds to get over this loss. It was just like lol that’s one of the biggest piece of turd games that there could be. Then i went on with my life.

I was a FR in college for the unlv loss in 87. We all watched in the dorm and everyone was going nuts until the tide turned. So depressing. That was really hard for me to get over. Worst experience I’ve ever had as a fan of any sports team and that includes hearing that Chris Street had died.

of course I will admit that Iowa basketball was way more important to me in the 80s and 90s than it is now. Maybe Lick and Alford killed the fun and it never came back. Or maybe I just got interested in more other things. But back in the 80s for me and my kith and kin every Iowa game was a major event and that UNLV loss was a big kick in the nuts

It must've been. You're still obsessing over it.

 

[Rolo Tomassi]

It seems really, really, really stupid to bank all of your enjoyment on an entire year of fandom on the results of 1-2 single elimination games.

I'm really disappointed by Thursday. I still really enjoyed this year.

Yes, me too. I enjoyed this year immensely, and I'm really optimistic about next year. That doesn't mean I can't consider our first round loss in the Tourney a real heartbreaker. And fwiw, I'm in the group that thinks Keegan returns next year.

 

[The Dad]

What about the fan who bitches about the average fan who bitches about the average fan?

A giant faggot.

 

[L. Wade Childress]

The emotional swing from Sunday to Thursday is why I love sports. Even when we lose. There are times when I choose to not get fully emotionally invested and times when I say fuck it and go all in. Sunday afternoon I didn’t see any way that we could lose Thursday they way we were playing.

So goes life. As I’ve said many times, what’s the point of doing anything if you are are scared shitless of failing, or can’t pick yourself up after losing?

Hope is fantastic but it is not a strategy. It sounds like we have a lot of fans that would move on from Fran in hopes that the next hire can make the second weekend.

 

[CamelTones]

I’m thrilled with where Iowa football and basketball are right now. I’d be more thrilled if both coaches looked at their clear deficiencies (football with QB and offense, basketball with defense) and made an honest attempt to correct them.

I don’t even like wrestling and I see people in that thread making excuses as to why Iowa can’t win like they used to. If there is a reason for it then maybe adjust what you’re doing and do what Penn State is.

 

[CamelTones]

It’s possible to both love Fran as a coach and want him here as long as he wants to be as well as be critical of some aspects of his program.

 

[L. Wade Childress]

I’m thrilled with where Iowa football and basketball are right now. I’d be more thrilled if both coaches looked at their clear deficiencies (football with QB and offense, basketball with defense) and made an honest attempt to correct them.

I don’t even like wrestling and I see people in that thread making excuses as to why Iowa can’t win like they used to. If there is a reason for it then maybe adjust what you’re doing and do what Penn State is.

In wrestling, iowa is taking a moral position against how PSU recruits. Not saying this is right or wrong- it’s a definite grey area- but it was in the best interest of the sport. NIL will allow us to compete financially.

same thing with the other sports. We run pretty clean programs. I am not sure I agree with intercollegiate athletics as a great place to stand your moral ground, but that’s what we’ve decided as an institution. When you had the local media making a huge deal about every legal transgression 10-15 years ago you are sort of forced to address it as a public institution.

 

[L. Wade Childress]

It’s possible to both love Fran as a coach and want him here as long as he wants to be as well as be critical of some aspects of his program.

i mean I suppose you can criticize his defense in terms of on-court outcomes, but I struggle to do that because in the greater picture Fran isn’t the one making college basketball brutally unwatchable and impossible to be officiated consistently.

 

[CamelTones]

It’s entirely possible that that is the case, but that sounds like a bullshit excuse out of the wrestling program.

 

[CamelTones]

i mean I suppose you can criticize his defense in terms of on-court outcomes, but I struggle to do that because in the greater picture Fran isn’t the one making college basketball brutally unwatchable and impossible to be officiated consistently.

Right but that’s not really an argument. Kirk has complained the last few years about how the cut block rules and lineman downfield rule have changed and it doesn’t benefit them. Unfortunately thats the way it’s called so the only thing preventing them from taking advantage of it is the Iowa coaches believing that’s how the rule should be applied.

Same thing applies to how the basketball team defends. They don’t have to openly tackle people, but officials let a shit ton of contact go on that end so take advantage of it. The one thing that probably bothers me the most about the loss to Richmond. You played the way you want to play defense without fouling and are in a position where the other team is in the 1 and 1 and Richmond had a 48% free throw shooter touch the ball twice in the last minute. Instead of just putting him on the line the moment he caught the ball, they gave him 2 layups and the foul.

 

[shoot-the-three]

Sorry, I put this loss right on the shoulders of Keegan Murray. I expect the other dolts to play like poop a lot of the times, but I never ever expected Keegan to outright give up on defense.

He allowed 3 different and-1 plays for 9 points down the stretch where he wasn't even trying. Was clueless on an inbound pass with his back turned, then let a shit player straight line him right to the basket with no resistance and then made the worst attempt at a steal on a guy that can't shoot 25 feet from the rim.

It was the closest thing to a Ronnie Harmon performance by an Iowa star since Ronnie. He has NEVER played that bad of defense in his entire career, and suddenly he does it on 3 fucking possessions in the tourney with the game on the line?

To make it even worse, he was completely non-existent on offense playing hot potato with the ball and literally running away from plays multiple times so he didn't have to touch it and shoot.

The last 2 pages of this thread (along with the possibility that Kris might be gone as well) is why I might even encourage Fran to look into taking another job and getting the fuck out of Iowa City and away from our piece of shit fans. IowaFan is just the fucking worst and we don't deserve him at this point.

It's always funny watching the random people (and not so random) come out of the woodwork the second Iowa loses a big game. They don't post shit most of if not the entire year, but the second something bad happens it is like flies on shit.

Thursday sucked. It sucked fucking hard, but it is the only time that Fran has truly shit the bed in the NCAA tournament at Iowa. He's been close to getting to the Sweet 16 and unfortunately the ball bounced the wrong way for him in 2019 when they were so damn close to doing it.

Anyways, the same fucksticks that were sucking his and the entire teams balls on right up until 2pm on Thursday now want him declared a complete failure and possibly gone.

Not really Fran's fault that his star player decided to not play defense and act like a complete weirdo for most of the game.

Would you encourage Keegan and Kris to both get the fuck out of Iowa City and away from our piece of shit fans too?

 

[L. Wade Childress]

It’s entirely possible that that is the case, but that sounds like a bullshit excuse out of the wrestling program.

what?

 

[CamelTones]

what?

That the wrestling program is taking a moral stance against the way Penn State recruits for the good of the sport.

 

[L. Wade Childress]

That the wrestling program is taking a moral stance against the way Penn State recruits for the good of the sport.

the iowa wrestling program currently does not have the institutional financial capability to recruit at psu’s level. This isn’t an excuse, it’s reality.